Curse

BahamutKaiser · Apr 19, 2006, 01:05 AM // 01:05

With each expansion A.net will likely bring about a new kind of PvP as well as complete PvE content. There are alot of realy interesting ways for PvP to expand, and I thought of one more, Brace Yourselves, Naval Warfare.

In Guild Wars, the actual "Guild Wars" or GvG takes place in Guild Halls, so far at least. If A.net made an expansion involving sea fairing exploration, as well as Guild owned Ships, and Guild "Naval" Wars, then we would have an entirely new way to combat.....

Well anyhow, this is how I envision it. You have to buy a Ship, just like buying a Guild Hall, from your Guild Hall you can see your ship, and at the bottom of your party tab you could select from either Land Warfare (regular GvG), or Board your ship for Naval Warfare and exploration.

When on a ship, you can move around on the deck, one player would have to grab the helm, and in turn he would become immobile, and his movements would steer the ship. Other players would either sit around, man one of the four cannons (2 on each side), or use new skills which grant special effects wile on the boat. Up to 8 players in your guild can participate on an excurtion.

Anyhow, when you locate an enemy ship the first thing you can do is start firing on it with the cannons, the cannons would have doulbe the range of normal actions, allowing you to fire at them from a distance. This would deal damage to the enemies aboard the ship, and perhaps the ship itself. Next you can move along side the enemy and board it, there would be special ropes along each side of the ship, allowing you to swing across onto the enemy ship. You can also line a plank so you can walk accross to the enemy ship, but it is a narrow path allowing for only 2 or 3 units to stand side by side, allowing for player blocking. Rangers and casters would be able to reach some targets from their end of the ship, but at some point you will have to board in order to attack enemy crew. Basicly, you have a Guild Lord on the ship like a normal Guild battle, and you have to kill him to win.

As for the ships taking damage, there would be skills from different classes that can repair the ship, make it go faster, protect the ship, and perhaps even ram other ships. When the ship takes damage it goes slower, allowing enemies to catch up with her, so if your trying to run or trying to catch up damaging the enemy ship helps. Elementist could use water magic to make the ship go faster, Ritualist could cast rituals which repair the ship, classes like monk could cast barriers to protect the ship. They could make warrior skills which allow them to Steer the ship into ramming, and Rangers could have a rope skill which allows him to hoist sails (minor speed increase) and board enemy ships when your close enough.

Basicly it is a GvG with more complexity, to make it more fun, alliances could form with a ship from up to 3 guilds, and fight Group Warfare, trying to surround enemy ships to take them down fast, trying to corner off enemies. With a large sea space to hide, maybe even dock ship to remove DP, or defend a home base, and try and keep enemies from bombarding your port before you can destroy theirs.

With this they would also have to add swimming. If you swing off the ship with no enemy beside you, or if your on the plank and you get hit by knockdown skills, or if your in mid swing and someone hits you with an interrupt, fall into the water. Some jobs could have skills that work wile swiming, having multipurpose skills for naval warfare is a good idea, since making the boat go faster doens't help any wile your fighting. For instance, the elementist water skill that allows him to make the boat go a little faster, makes him go alot faster wile swiming, Assassin can have a skill that automaticly teleports him back to his boat. Along side your boat are ropes you can use to draw yourself back onto your boat, but you can't use the enemies, unless your a ranger, and you use your roping skill to get onto an enemy boat from the water. They could also make it where certain armors impare your swimming, forcing you to get a seafairing armor, or get a special kind of "infusion" which makes your armor float.

Aside from GvG combat, Guilds could take their ship to unique locations or missions only reachable by ship. Wile on the sea you can fight NPC enemy ships, reach special locations on the sea, like Lyssa's Island, which would be like UW. You could also reach new towns which afterward would be accessible through map selector. At some of these new towns you could buy special armor that resembles pirate, sailor, or marine outfits, like Sea versions of 15K armor. You could even come across Sea Monsters and have to fight a big battle to earn some nice loot or materials.

I think this would be an awsome way for A.net to expand Guild activities and gameplay, as well as include this kind of content in several new missions. With High Seas exploration, players can enjoy searching the seas for new locations, trying to fight enemy hoards, or navigate treacherous passages, reaching totaly new continents and numberous islands along the way.

I give credit to my sister who inspired this idea, I was thinking about how much I would hate a Pirate "Class", and although the name Pirate just doesn't ring any bells with me, the idea of naval warfare with ships came to mind and I thought it was a great opportunity. If they did make naval warfare in an expansion then they realy don't need to add a class with it, but it wouldn't hurt to have a new class, expecially one which had to do with high seas combat, I would call it a mariner though. All of the jobs would need sea fairing adaptations and naval support or attack skills to make a fair addition, but it wouldn't hurt if one was made for it.

Nevin · Apr 19, 2006, 01:07 AM // 01:07

Reminds me of a Mod for Battlefield 1942, called Pirates. But yeah I like it... A lot of stuff could be added to GW, I try not to post too often about it though.

TheLordOfBlah · Apr 19, 2006, 01:09 AM // 01:09

The game is CALLED GUILD WARS not NAVAL WARS. There probably is a game called that, so go buy that instead.

That also would get rid of necessity of a variety of classes in the "Naval War" and character level, stat pts etc wouldnt matter because you'd be shooting at ships...

Oh and by the way, the new games ARENT expansions.

xBakox · Apr 19, 2006, 01:14 AM // 01:14

Quote:

The game is CALLED GUILD WARS not NAVAL WARS. There probably is a game called that, so go buy that instead.

Based on that, who said the guilds fought on land? Maybe they had planes? Maybe the guilds are actually cults in the future.

Saying that because its called Guild Wars it cant have ships is a very bad reason.

On the other hand...I dont really think that its that nessicary. Sure we have boat travel and stuff, but I dont think naval battles fit in too well.

New class: Pirates anyone? :P

BahamutKaiser · Apr 19, 2006, 01:56 AM // 01:56

A pirate is nothing without the sea, so suggesting a pirate class without naval warfare is kind of like suggesting a pilot without planes.....

As a side not, a guild is a group of people, in no way does that seclude it to land combat. Sure Naval Combat would make the game better, enrich the gameplay, be fun, add more activities for guilds to do together, make a very interesting "chapter", and perhaps make room for a "pirate" like class, although I did say I would rather such a class be called a Mariner. But don't worry, there is an option for players who don't want the game to have anything new outside of what is already in the game, don't buy the next expansion.

As for "they arn't Expansions", that is just a term technicality which everyone recognizes. Since you wanted to bring up the individuality of each game, I would like to point out that the cost of an entirely new game should introduce completely new elements of gameplay into each, since it isn't just an "expansion".

Winterclaw · Apr 19, 2006, 03:14 AM // 03:14

Nice idea for an expansion

-Most people wouldn't want cannons, but balista, catapults, and elementalists would do just fine in sinking the enemy ship.
-No in battle repairs. Make the ship like the guild lord and if you sink it or capture it you win.
-Escape should be an option.
-Instead of a pirate class, make an Earl Flynnesque swashbuckler class.
-Add arenas where you are swimming or underwater which might effect combat, weapon ranges, and elemental damage.
-Add ship vs fort where one guild's ship would have to attack a guild hall on land or on a coast if that guild didn't have a ship or doesn't want to use it.
-Some ships could be manned by NPCs in the beginning and the leader of the party could give them commands about what to do.

Daemon Dremora · Apr 19, 2006, 03:25 AM // 03:25

to me it sounds alot like puzzle pirates.... i dont know if any of you have played it but that is what it sounds like to me. i dont think it is an entirely bad idea i just dont know how well it would fit into guildwars. but i am glad to see people popping out new ideas about what could happen in game.

Ken Dei · Apr 19, 2006, 06:51 AM // 06:51

Well theoretically this could simply be a Modded, larger version of the Snowball Arena Game.

actionjack · Apr 19, 2006, 07:04 AM // 07:04

somehow I just think warrior in full plat armor would sink...

Anyhow... moving ship.... eeek.. To my knowledge, the few game that have the moving ships.. LineageII and WoW.. all have some problem with it... (clipping issue, where character would "fall" out of the ship) Not to say it could be fix...

Ship battle sounds fun, and I do want a expansion around ships, sailing, the sea, island hopping, giant sea monster, and new land. So yes, I want a sea battle.

However... I think placing one person in charge of the helm (which in effect might control the whole fate of your team) isn't such good idea.... I would go with a automatic driving system.. if possible... (run on tracks)

Well, guess your sister is a better game idea developer than you.. hahaha
(next thing you know, we will all be battling on flying dragons....)

Dr Strangelove · Apr 19, 2006, 08:29 AM // 08:29

I would support this only if I was allowed to pillage my enemies' booty with my mizzenmast.

jackie · Apr 19, 2006, 09:11 AM // 09:11

Idea is great and it would make a good expansion IF it's executed properly so there wouldn't be all clitching/clipping/buggering/stattering, and that it wouldn't feel dull.

I've seen so many games failing to do that. But if that idea would work then at least I would be enjoying full heartly

fiery · Apr 19, 2006, 01:35 PM // 13:35

Guild Wars water polo anyone?

Raziel665 · Apr 19, 2006, 01:52 PM // 13:52

Dont see it happening, but a new smaller PvP arena, set on the deck of a large boat in the middle of the ocean would be pretty darn cool.

BahamutKaiser · Apr 20, 2006, 11:46 PM // 23:46

Ok, I tried to respond to this earlier, but accidentally erased my response.....

Cannons are already in Guild Wars, go to the screenshots for Factions and check out the giant land turtles with cannons mounted on them.....

Falling off the boat and swimming is actually part of the concept, there are ways to fall in or perhaps even jump in on purpose, than you have to climb back onboard you ship.

As for lag and it's effects on a moving plain. In order to ensure this doesn't become a problem, the players on a ship would need to have their location determined by a point on the ship, this way if you did lag, you would retain a spot on the ship rather then stand there wile the boat continues without you. This is one of those programming technicallities, but it isn't an unmatchable feat. Players movement on the boat would work the exact same way they would on something that isn't moving, the boat however would be moving on an open surface, they can nearly be programmed seperately, as to say, even though you see your boat moving around, the programmed reality is that the boat is a solid immobile piece mounted to the dock, and only the helmsman is actually on the sea moving about. Never mind if you don't understand that.

As for trusting the player at the helm, this is a feature which would be more enjoyable then frustrating. If you take the player off the helm your not realy exploring the sea and strategicly steering your ship in combat, if you take this away your basicly just fighting on a glorified carrosel, it isn't sea exploration. Depending on teammates is something you already have to deal with in GW, Monk is the primary example, there are roles in which someone will have to fill, and you will just have to hope he can do his job right. And since the primary use of Ships will be in Guilds, the person steering the ship your on is going to be a guild mate, so it isn't some stranger who is likely to screw around, you will have to trust him the same way you trust you monk to do his job. Tou wouldn't want to take away the monk job just because players can fail at their role.

Being able to mount on a ship and explore the sea looking for lost islands to fight on, overcoming the unfriendly denizens of the sea, and reaching glorious locations, is everything you asked for in your recent post, "Future Aim of GW". Teams of people you know having not just a new exhilerating PvP mode, but having a unique exploration and PvE opportunity to enjoy.

As for normal missions and gameplay available to people outside of Guilds, the missions which emplore Seafaring should probably be on automatic cruise, where the NPC takes you where you need to go. As you get toward the end of the game you could run into missions which introduce you to more and more involving parts of controling the ship, starting with manning the cannons, to eventually steering the ship. This way players would get a slow and easy education on how to use ship utilities properly, instead of harrasing eachother at the helm.

Kool Pajamas · Apr 21, 2006, 12:01 AM // 00:01

I dont see this happening as GvG. Maybe an area like the fort aspenwood or Jade Quarry or even Alliance battles in Factions. Could be something like that but i doubt GvG.

Zhou Feng · Apr 21, 2006, 12:16 AM // 00:16

This sounds more like an additional PvP option... Im not sure whether it can be implemented. There are some loops to it. Like how and when does an enemy ship appear? Is it part of the "wait for enemy guild" thing?

BahamutKaiser · Apr 22, 2006, 04:11 AM // 04:11

This isn't a small add on to put in an update, if it is added it would be the better part of a whole expansion.

For GvG in the naval arena, it would be just like a GvG is now, you set up your team and wait til you get a matchup. The difference is you both start in your ship at a location in a GvG sea zone.

With Guild Sea Exploration you would be exploring the sea the same way you would explore a land location, you enter an instance, and the mobs are located at different places on the sea and islands. The big difference here is that many locations would not be towns you could teleport to, you would have to travel to them. Traders, Crafters, and other port towns would be on the sea. Only a few cities, and certain ship teleports would exsist as a way for your boat to travel to different sectors of the ocean, that way once you discover a new part of the ocean, you can pick up your exploration from that point/checkpoint.

This is an addition that far overshoots an added class or nifty function, I'm not implying this activity as part of factions, it would be a major waste.

Mr. G · Aug 07, 2006, 12:43 PM // 12:43

I dont intend to become the ranting fool but.....

Pros:
-More guild related fun, for a game called guild wars I always thought it was kinda guild lacking
-A farier way to battle muliple jobs stops people going too low level or wrong class
-would have good music (yo-ho-ho and so on)
-new classes (but please not pirates...my god the pirate stereotype is so bad)
-I want some funky naval clothes, somehting very british redcoat would be nice, and one of those fancy tri-corner hats
-Funnyman didnt post this idea

Cons:
-This sea would have to be DAM big, even thou it prob would be a new "expansion" game the idea of districts shoudl still be in there somewhere, even if its just the 7 seas (or how ever many GW seas there are)
-with all this PvP going on you'll prob get blitzed at low levels, there should be "international waters" border lines (kinda like the Kurzick/luxon thing) where PvP starts or ends

Some random things I thought of:

Falling off the ship? is it a simple matter of climbing back on or a Shiro banish kinda thing, where you have to fight your way back?

If this proposed "expansion" is very Guild focued, lets replace guildhalls with port towns, they could have the guild hall in the centre (for GvG persposes) but you should be able to wander around your town, sink more money into pointless stuff like banners and a town drunk to wander around mumbling - kinda like AoE 3 if you've ever played it

well thats my $0.57

BahamutKaiser · Aug 07, 2006, 11:22 PM // 23:22

Thanks for the props G..... (ok fell free to laugh).

Even though it is the "Open Sea" the sea can be broken up into several parts, which have to be accessed just like normal explorable areas, zoning. The sea can have alot more space because you don't need to program nearly so much landscape, you just have to program water 2 or 4 forms and then repeat it over large areas, and the enemies can be spread out a bit as well.

I didn't intend to introduce a MMO space where players can run into seperate Guilds sailing the sea, if it could be supported it would be a major adaptation to the game, adding a truely MMO element, but I don't expect this nor truely appreciate this. I intended for PvP on the Sea to be a optional battle mode available from your guild hall, it would be a second option under the exsisting guild battle option to allow you to participate in a Sea Arena against another Guild in a match not on the open sea.

It would be great to have PvP modes with a great deal of space and multiple teams trying to take over, almost like HoH on the Sea...... 4 Guild FFA.

I intended for reboarding the ship to be a simple task of swimming back to your ship and touching a Rope or lever on the side of the ship to hoist yourself up, basicly teleporting you back on the ship. It is a very simple task.... as long as the ship isn't moving..... 2 or 3 times faster than you.

I'm sorry I labeled you G, but I am not of the ilk who tells people they can't post something simular if I or someone else already has. I don't like when people post a PoS version of an idea when something better has already been made, but I think it is the Moderators fault for not highlighting such an expansive idea in the compilation Suggestions in this Forum. They could also merge minor topics of simularity to a more developed version of the same topic, but that often confuses people. It would be nice if Threads where attached to thread groups, so all threads of the same type would tied together. For example, if you tie all Samurai threads together, their links would all be together lined up in a row, the threads would be seperate, but the topics would be bundled together so links to all other major discussions on that topic would be readily available for comparison.

I really think the Moderators need to reorganize the Suggestion Compilation into groups including each major and developed topic seperated by topic and arranged by significance and probability. I am basicly the only other person who has started a Sea Farring thread, so I don't see how it is so wrong for one more person to make a thread, or even 4. After all, there are about 20 Auction House threads, and I have yet to read one that isn't disfunctional.

Plushie Penguin · Aug 07, 2006, 11:43 PM // 23:43

more on the ship part, as getting one for the guild...
the ship idea should play out like how our past countries did, buying them, fixing them, and making them/buying them... could go 2 ways as I see it
1. you have to buy one, and wait for it to be made, so if your guild has just lost their ship[if that's possable], you can't just jump right back into ship vs. ship
2. same as 1 but, your guild can make their own as well, it would cost maybe a little less[no labor fees, just parts], you can design it yourself[or use a feature that let's you choose what part goes where, in moderation, can't have the helm at the bow of the boat], it would take longer to make, but it could help fit your pvp plans

as for getting back on your ship, are we talking this world's kind of ships that would fit in gw time style, or some new kind? I could imagine teleports like the ones at quarry and aspenwood fitting in somewhere